Seeking The Soul: Deb Kennedy And Kate Young Wilder

Seeking the Soul: Deb Kennedy and Kate Young Wilder

Heart-to-Heart Conversations with the People of Rolling Ridge

By Rev. Michael Reed

Each month this year, we spend time “Seeking the Soul” as Michael Reed, our Associate Director, shares thought-provoking conversations with our Rolling Ridge program leaders. Today’s interview is with Kate Young Wilder and Deb Kennedy. They’re the leaders of our upcoming “Joyful Gathering” workshop on May 30th, during Artist Week, where they teach contemplation and spirituality — using art! Their workshops are filled with watercolors, mandalas, haiku poetry, and always, always joy.

We first interviewed Kate and Deb last year. This year, they’re back, sharing wisdom on how to cultivate joy even in the midst of suffering. They discuss the nature of spiritual friendship, the essential intersections of faith and art, and the small things that bring them joy—including favorite pens for drawing!

Questions from Michael Reed for Kate and Deb are in bold. Deborah Kennedy’s answers are initialized with DK. Kate Young Wilder’s answers are initialized with KYW and are also italicized. 
 

I met you and interviewed you last year, not long after your first Joyful Gathering event at Rolling Ridge. Can you reacquaint us with who you are?

DK (Deb Kennedy): I retired from a long career in business and am now a leadership coach and a full-time artist. I have been a painter since my twenties, always curious to learn about color and light and form. The artist side of me has influenced my faith and my career in some interesting ways.

KYW (Kate Young Wilder): I want to mention a few things about Deb that she is perhaps too modest to say for herself. Deb is a real artist. Her work wins awards. She was recently honored with induction into the National Association of Women Artists. I love those parts of her. And the reason I am the emerging artist that I am today is because Deb kept showing up with paintbrushes and colors and pens! She is a natural teacher, one who shares her gifts, and shares them well. I am the fortunate woman who gets to be her weekly Art & God friend.

DK: And Kate and I first met when I was working for a private Christian school producing a week-long experiential learning curriculum for the students in grades 6-12. Kate was one of our recruited special faculty and she led a workshop for the kids which combined words and art in some amazing ways. We were instantly drawn into conversations about art and faith. Over the years, our friendship has grown, and our discussions have always been vulnerable and honest.  I am truly blessed. Our friendship is one of the true treasures of my life.

KYW: And also mine!

  Above: Participants at the Joyful Gathering Workshop at Rolling Ridge in 2023.

It's been a year since I last sat down with you, after you led a “Joyful Gathering” workshop at Rolling Ridge that was full to overflowing. Catch us up on what’s happened since then. What’s happened in your lives over the past year?

DK: It has been a year of ups and downs. I lost a close spiritual friend to cancer recently. My husband and I prayed my way through our son’s long job outage during the spring and summer and our little dog, Rudy, passed in December. At times, I was very discouraged and God felt very distant. In hindsight, I learned a great deal about the value of my spiritual practices - spiritual reading, contemplative prayer, making art, following rhythms. They held me in place when I was down and produced an inner peace that I was lacking.

DYW: It seems that each year I become more and more certain of the importance of this intersection of prayer and art. These practices are not a side activity that I turn to in my spare time: they are foundational in my life. 

In this past year, I have become much more committed to writing. I have always been a writer. As a child, I would make little books of poems using the big stapler from my Dad’s coveted old desk. l have always loved collecting words. 

I was fortunate enough to publish a book with Doubleday in my 40s. Now, in my 60s I am putting together a manuscript of my poetry. I am working with the amazing poet and editor, James Crews, in his Monthly Pause community. What an incredibly supportive and generative experience this is.

Have those experiences shaped or helped evolve the upcoming Joyful Gathering workshop in May?

DK: In terms of the Joyful Gathering, I think all of this — the ups and the downs — feeds how we approach a gathering. Faith is real and sometimes hard and not always full of answered prayers. Faith is about keeping on and moving step by step until the next oasis. Hopefully, the Joyful Gathering can be an oasis for those who come. 

KYW: Yes. This is essential. A Joyful Gathering isn't just for the joyful or joyfully inclined. It is for those who seek ways to explore spiritual practices to bolster us and center us when life isn't joyful. At all.

And yes, this year, we will incorporate a couple of writing exercises in A Joyful Gathering at Rolling Ridge. I developed a new one to assist people in a prayer meditation of recollection. I love the low threshold it provides for entering the room of metaphor and image. My goal is, “No intimidating threat with writing. Just love of words and memory.”

Your upcoming workshop is called “Joyful Gathering.” What do you mean by joy, exactly—is it the same thing as happiness? Why is it a good and necessary goal for our spiritual lives?

KYW: Joy is not the same as happy. Happy is walking by a playground of children swinging in the spring air. Happy is a moment: given, not necessarily cultivated. Joy, I think, is a result. It comes from a process. There is a deepness to joy. One of the great things about joy is you can nurture it. It’s part of that wonderful list in Galatians, about the fruit of the Spirit: love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, gentleness, and self-control. Like the best fruit you eat and enjoy in your life, joy is a product. It is a result of good soil, good rain, good sun–all those necessary elements of growth. 

I believe that when we remain attuned to the flow of the Holy Spirit, we deeply know the truth that Joy is available–no matter the outer realities. When we attend to the holy habits of prayer, reflection, gratitude, service, and reverence, we live more fully. And that’s what Deb and I both want. It’s what we talk about every Wednesday morning with our Zoom and coffee.

DK: I recently read ‘The Return of the Prodigal’ by Henri Nouwen. In it, he made a contrast between cynicism and joy. So many people live in cynicism and resentment. Nouwen wrote “Every moment of each day I have the chance to choose between cynicism and joy. Every thought I have can be cynical or joyful… every choice for joy, in turn, reveals more joy and offers more reason to make life a true celebration.” We can consciously choose the lens we use to view situations, conversations, happenings. Joy is possible, even when happiness is not.
 

 
A contemplative, prayerful mandala. Right: Art and quote

What small, insignificant thing brings you joy?

DK: Birds. For some reason (maybe its age), I have a strong appreciation for the diversity and design of birds. The colors and the feather designs are amazing for each. The sounds and songs all unique. I find this really joyful to consider. And the light on the landscape on Cape Cod never disappoints.

KYW: Pens. (a Pilot G-2 for writing and a Sakura Micron 03 and 08 for drawing.) The drip of candle wax on candlesticks I’ve collected for 40 years. stones: River stones, stones found at the ocean’s edge, stones discovered in the woods Sending and receiving cards in the mail—old fashioned goodness!

You talk about finding joy even in the midst of darkness. How have you learned to approach pain and suffering—as contemplatives, as artists, or as Christians?

DK: As my friend, Deanna, went through an almost three-year fight with cancer, I watched her real pragmatism about the possible outcomes. She was not a gushy, sweet believer but someone who thought deeply about faith and expressed it in ways that were open and honest and accepting. During the final three months when we knew there would be no more trials we had some wonderful conversations. She struggled mightily with her faith in those times, but God somehow came near to her three weeks before she passed and she was transformed in ways that were amazing. She had a good passing, surrounded by lots of friends and family, good food, laughs and tears. She chose to face her reality with joy. Her death was actually a joyful process. I was in awe. 

As a follow-up to that, how do you think that prayer and contemplation change us?

KYW: There is a line I like by CS Lewis where he writes, “I pray because the need flows out of me all the time. Waking and sleeping. It doesn’t change God. It changes me.” I love that. 

As a child and as a younger adult, I prayed to a sort of heavenly Santa, “Please give me this.” Or to some sort of big boss manager, “Fix this. Change this. Correct this problem.” 

Just yesterday, a beloved and life-long friend had a heart attack. In praying about this, I was not so much of a mind to say, “Please heal her. Please don’t let this be.” My prayer was more like, “Dear God, how might I respond well to this? What will it look like to represent your love for her in this new season of recovery?” 

I also find I am not quite as interested in judging others as I used to be. I hope this means I am maturing in important ways. 
 

 
What have you been painting lately?

DK: I have been experimenting with new approaches and materials - lots of acrylics and inks and pastels and different tools. It has been fun and expressive and intuitive. 

KYW: And it's really messy! Deb and I painted together in March by her pool in Florida. One thing I noticed was I was very organized. I kept my supplies all lined up, my brushes and hands clean, my breathing regular. Deb was a mess! She was all over the place with colors and splashes and kooky lines. She was tearing up paper and putting stuff here and there. Squinting. Trying again. I learned a lot that day about getting free in your art!

One of the things I admire about both of you is your friendship. You’ve described each other as “soul friends.” What’s your secret? And do you think most people today undervalue friendship?

KYW: Personally, I don’t think that most people undervalue friendship. I think we know, deep down in our truest selves, that it is essential. But it doesn’t seem that we teach ourselves and our children to make time for what growing a strong relationship requires. 

Deb and I are committed to one another. We make notes about what is happening in each other’s lives and in the lives of our children, grandchildren, and friends. We are dedicated pray-ers for each other’s daily lives. We ask questions and follow up on stuff. 

I know many people blame technology for the lack of quality in relationships these days. But we find that it has helped us, tremendously, in being connected. But we are intentional. Very, very intentional. We know our friendship is a gift. We nurture it out of respect for the very grace of it. 

What advice would you share for people looking to develop spiritual friendships?

DKL: Go slow. Get together or talk on a committed regular basis. Be vulnerable and share the embarrassing and difficult things. Pray together and for each other. Laugh and play.

KYW: Yes, I like all of those things that Deb said. She nailed it! 

I think another bit of wisdom I would share is to express your gratitude to each other. During the time of Deb’s friend Deanna’s illness and passing, I think we each became acutely aware of how vulnerable we actually are in our friendships. You invest and invest in a person and it just might not last, no matter what you hope. Circumstances and illnesses take friends from us. Deb and I both know that to be too true. So I think we have become more tender with each other. More grateful. So very grateful.

Scenes from A Joyful Gathering at Rolling Ridge in 2023
 

We’re so glad that you’re part of our Rolling Ridge community, both as retreat leaders and as participants. How did you come to find us, and how have you been involved lately?

DK: I believe we are meant to share in community. Rolling Ridge is a wonderful place to connect with others interested in spending time exploring faith. I have been part of the artist’s SoulCare group each month, and hope to become more involved in the future. 

KYW: About 7 years ago, I retired, remarried, and returned to my hometown in New Hampshire after 30+ years in the Boston area. My husband and I attend a Methodist Church there. One morning, I saw a brochure for Rolling Ridge on a faded bulletin board in the fellowship hall. I was immediately drawn to this place. 

I attended an Advent quiet retreat day a few years back. We were invited to explore the house, find the [creche] scenes tucked here and there, and spend time at each one. I felt like a child again, exploring the stairways, nooks, and corners. We were invited to read, pray, write, and draw in response to holy invitations. Read. Pray. Write. Draw. Four of my favorite activities! 
At the end of the day, we gathered together and I heard from pastors, lay servants, music directors, and spiritual directors about their much-needed encounters: With silence. With God. I knew that day that I would return to the Ridge. I have now participated in several offerings: silent retreat days, labyrinth walks, Artist Soul Care, and The Listening Collective for Spiritual Directors. In July, my husband and I will join Kent Harrop for a Pray and Paddle Retreat that focuses on the poetry of Mary Oliver. I am really excited for that!

At Rolling Ridge, I sense an expansiveness of thought and intent. It is a beautiful and inspiring place for me to explore so many aspects of the sacred. 

Where can people find your artwork?

DK: I share my art life on Instagram at @debkennedyart and my website - www.debrakennedystudios.com. I am also at The Gallery on Main in Falmouth, MA. 

KYW: I am putting together an exhibit on my Mary Oliver project but have not yet landed a home. I am still very much in the play stage but had an offer for a small gallery opportunity in September. I also share artwork, poetry, and writing that can be found on Kate and I’s shared website, ajoyfulgathering.net.

 
Where can people sign up for your next Joyful Gathering?
    
Our next Joyful Gathering is at Rolling Ridge on Thursday, May 30th from 9:30-3:30 and is one of three different day retreats offered as part of Rolling Ridge’s second Artist Week from May 28-31. People can learn more and sign up on the Rolling Ridge website.  The registration link is here. Flexible overnight options are available.

One final question. At the last Joyful Gathering, we served cake—just because! Will you have cake at the one coming up later this month?

DK: Of course! “ If there is no cake, it is just a meeting!”

KYW: That’s right, Julia Child and Deb Kennedy!

 Above: Deb Kennedy (left) and Kate Young Wilder(right).

Note: These responses from Kate and Deb have been edited
and abridged for length and clarity.